portland independent media center  
images audio video
newswire article commentary oregon & cascadia

government | political theory

Solidarity against Bush (aka the hard-right)

An appeal to Reason: A call to Solidarity! People voting in the next election need to remember the last one. Only a solid, unified front against Bush could beat him. It could. Maybe.
I am over saturated with News about how screwed up the current admin is and how some people are grumbling about Kerry already. WELL, so far Kerry is the front runner for the Democrats, and I support him because of that. If it were Dean, I would support him. If it becomes Kuchinich, I will support him too. Democrats, or rather, anti-current admin, anti-right, anti - republicans have a very important lesson to implement: we need to stick together to get rid of Bush, at all cost. Regardless of the minor imperfections of any freakin Democratic nominee, the Dems are the only party with a chance to defeat Bush. Do you agree? If you don't, and unfortunately there are many, you may be living too much in an ideolological world, ahead of the times in the U. S. And if you don't vote for the Democratic nominee , you are going to learn a hard lesson all over again. We all will. Bush number 1 taught us not to trust those kind in our govt.

Our suspicions were confirmed when Bush 2 stole the next election. Yeah, I know all about the coruption on that one! Now look how screwed our govt is. Do you really think that those SOBs are gonna roll over and give up even if they are outvoted? They must be crushed at the polls. Crushed! Crushed! This cannot be accomplished without a unified opposing front:
Dems and liberals and moderate republicans and anarchists need to stop freaking bickering about this and that!

UNITE UNITE UNITE or it will be the undoing of us all. These right wing guys are serious guys! Right wingers killed JFK, or has everyone forgotton? What is wrong with everyone's memory?

I have played hardball with the illegal tenant market (artists lofts) in Boston, up against multimillion dollar corporations and their fucking anti-people lawyers in favor of artists live-n loft rights. And just so I could afford a place as a professional photographer. But what I learned along the way applies to fighting the powers.
2 separate times I have played hardball with them (Boston Wharf Co and Beacon Realty) for a total of 14 months. Most people were chicken-shit to stand up for their rights. Some helped, but boy did I have to do spend a lot of time convincing! Let me tell you, this is not a democracy and you are hard-pressed to call on your constitutional rights, even proper tenant rights. Sitting at home whining and emailing, fantasizing about a communist America with a quasi-Communist as president will get you another 4 years of the opposite. (sorry Kuchinich supporters, he has excellent ideals but do you think the hard right will even let him on the white house lawn?) People need to get off their asses...I have met with former Senator Lynch (now in the US house of Reps) and have met Ted Kennedy, Eunice Shriver... I have been through 4 different lawyers, been part of 2 organizations for artists against illegal tenant rights abuses in Boston. THE REALITY IS THAT NO ONE GIVES A F... ABOUT THE SMALL CITIZEN. Maybe casting a vote is the only impowerment you will ever have in your entire life. Casting a vote may be the only thing the majority of citizens will ever do to try and have some say in who governs them. And casting a vote may not even be enough this time around with the Diebold machines. But if we don't stand united, against the Bush machine, WE ARE TO BLAME FOR ALL WE GET! PERIOD! MARK THESE WORDS!

Dennis Sagwitz
Veteran, Operation Urgent Fury
82nd Airborne Division, 83-86
U MASS Cum Laude Alumni, 1992
Professional Photographer
German Immigrant 1974

add your comments
oh just shut up 26.Mar.2004 13:33

free thinker

it really doesn't fucking matter that much who is president. what matters is how you live your life. i am so fucking sick of hearing about how much this election matters. IT DOESN'T. take fucking 5% of the energy you're putting into this AnyoneButBush crap (and i'm talking to all of you) and put it into making your own communities more democratic and sustainable. from the bottom up -- that's the only way things are going to change. the president only matters if you cede your life and freedom to him. i ain't ceding nothin'. fuck that noise.

You aren't saying what many people here at pdx.indymedia like to hear 26.Mar.2004 13:41

politics as possible

Dennis Sagwitz ---

As Arnold has proven in California, the American people will choose to perpetuate their fantasies and illusions before they will confront the reality of their condition. As represented by the frequent posters here, more leftist or radical people are similarly in love with their fantasy worlds but their fantasies are different. Whereas the mainstream wants to believe that some action figure will emerge from the sky and blast away with impressively stern musculature at the corruptness of the system, leftists like to believe in the fantasy that the American public is just at the point of WAKING UP after years of somnolence, passivity and compliance. So, people who think independently of the corporate media (the IMC community) don't especially like to hear about the political realities that have been built and continue to thrive based upon the old saw: "Nobody ever went broke underestimating the stupidity of the American public."

Then there is the human tendency to blame the messenger for the message. So you maybe have gotten or will draw some flak.

The way I see it is that Kerry (and even Kucinich) have made some tough political decisions that they maybe now regret as representatives of the great, yet nonetheless FICKLE, American people. Politics is commonly defined as the "art of compromise" --- but Americans would like to believe in some father figure who is autocratically above compromise, sort of the way God Almighty is. So they tend to go for someone like Dumbya who owns enough of the media to spin his contradictions, lies and deceits into examples of wisdom (or, failing wisdom, cleverness, or in desperation, self-deprecatory humor). The more leftist people again are different, they would like to find a flawless leader who has never compromised, a saintly charismatic person ready-made for the pantheon where Abe Lincoln sits with his lob cabin on display and where George Washington is remembered for his cherry tree. The problem is what I call the god-king-president syndrome.

So that's the problem with Kerry's record in Congress. Interesting, I think, that some of the leftist critics of Kerry go to rightest web sites for their run-downs on Kerry. As for what Kerry may say between now and November, I think that it has to be born in mind that he is engaged in a contest with the neo-con (or "hard-right") element that is really writing a whole new rule book as they proceed toward their goal of dominance and hegemony --- a one-party state. To the neo-cons, this 2004 election is just as much a war as is the war against Islamicism that includes the war on Iraq. The rules of the Kerry/Bush contest in 2004 have not been decided upon with any of Kerry's input requested or considered. (There has been no response to Kerry's suggested of periodic televised debates.) So, with the realities of the contest in mind, if people ask me, should we believe what Kerry says? I say, Hell No! But does that make him a liar or a thief? Probably we have all told lies and done things we are ashamed of. So I see Kerry as a human being who finds himself in a situation that requires him to do things that are impossible and to present himself as someone who could never exist in the real world. I cut him some slack on that account and hope for the best for the election and for the future of the world and the country.

WHERE KERRY FITS INTO THIS TWO-PARTY MESS: Polls show that most Americans are NOT divided along ideological lines. That impression is the result of right-wing talk-show thinking that has come to be accepted as "conventional wisdom", even or especially by self-styled radicals such as those posting here at pdx.indymedia. The polls show, however, that the vast majority of Americans, if asked to identify as "liberal" or "conservative" or "moderate," will self-identify as "moderate." Here at pdx.indymedia many would like to think that if "radical" were offered as a fourth choice, that would be the popular selection of typical Americans --- but that is hardly the reality. What most Americans want now is to return to some safe middle-ground. Many Republicans and "apparatchiks" within even the secret government also want to return to something more like "normalcy." Bush is seen as too de-stabilizing. So Kerry is seen, and has been selected, as the man to do the job of returning to the "status quo ante." THE REPUBLICANS --- having eliminated the middle-ground by their long-term strategy of destoying the center --- MUST PICTURE KERRY AS A LEFTIST RADICAL. True radicals, such as those posting here at pdx.indymedia, react to the media portrayal of Kerry as a radical with disgust and outrage because, of course, Kerry is a moderate --- despite his progressive biography, anti-Vietnam-war activism and his visit to Nicaragua to pow-wow with Daniel Ortega back in the Sandinista period. That pow-wow cost Kerry politically when Ortega followed up two weeks later with a visit to Moscow --- the Republicans in Massachusetts attacked on the basis of Ortega's visit to Moscow and are still running Kerry down over it. So Kerry remembers that. After all, with three purple hearts, he is a survivor. He lives and he learns. Thus, KERRY MUST COUNTER THE REPUBLICAN STRATEGY of portraying Kerry as a radical by denying any of the charges of radical activism and spouting the standard bull about, for example, Chavez and Castro. In that way, he denies the Republicans their main strategy in 2004 --- to make the election a referendum on Kerry. Almost automatically, any election for a second term for a president is always a referendum on the sitting president. If the election goes that way --- a referendum on Bush --- the Republicans will be defeated. The Republican strategy --- making the election into a referendum on Kerry --- is out of desperation. The Bush neo-cons and the secret government probably have even more desperate options under consideration --- such as voting machine fraud, the possible "October surprise," or who-knows-what. But the election and what Kerry says cannot be adequately assessed without understanding the Republican campaign strategy in 2004.

Am I saying that we only have two choices: taking a chance on what Kerry will do after he is elected or preparing for total war if Bush is elected? Yes, that's what I am saying. Neither Bush nor Kerry will have the power to end the class-oriented "low-intensity" warfare manifested in such phenomena as the attempted CIA-coup against Chavez and the so-called "drug war" in Columbia. Perhaps, however, Kerry could nix some of the worst of it at the presidential level. The question isn't whether we should end the class conflict that is an expression of the objective contradictions of the global hegemony of capital --- no one has the power to do that. The question is how we would like to mold the conditions and perimeters of the conflict. For example, in the Middle East, who has the power to solve the Israel/Palistine conflict? It has been suggested that a new force, "global public opinion," may come to bear. What we know about Bush and the neocons is that they have no respect whatsoever for global public opinion. Probably, Kerry has some such respect. That won't make Kerry powerful enough to bring peace, but it may make that new force, "global public opinion," more powerful.

Some say, "So what if Havana is bombed? So what if the nightmare intensifies? Then the American People will finally awaken!" What was it Hamlet said? Something to the effect of should we just do it and get it over with --- perchance to die, "perchance to dream," or do we keep on suffering "the slings and arrows of outrageous fortune"?

DENNIS - Take All Your "Election" Energy 26.Mar.2004 13:41

And Work On


isn't this SPAM? 26.Mar.2004 13:44

indy reader

i appeal to the pdx indy editors to start composting this shit. isn't this spam at this point? if some other corporate interest, like starbucks or nike, came to this site and start posting all over it, that shit would be composted like anything! the democrats are just another corporation, like starbucks or nike, so wipe 'em offa here. PLEEEEEAZZE!

"at all cost"?!?!?!?! 26.Mar.2004 13:47

sick of this mess

"we need to stick together to get rid of Bush, at all cost." Really? At ALL cost? so, like, we should send a hundred nuclear weapons down into the center of the earth and blow up the planet because that would get rid of Bush? Well, it would! you said, "at all cost"!! but you don't really mean it. you can't. if you do, you are as much of a madman as you accuse bush of being.

get real, loser.

yes, it is spam 26.Mar.2004 13:53

pro-war spam

"What is wrong with everyone's memory?"

What's wrong with yours? You erroneously believe that Nader won electoral votes; that the election was rigged but it's still somehow Nader's fault; and you seem to conveniently forget that Clinton killed more people than Bush while dismantling the social-safety net just as effectively and efficiently as Bush and that Kerry has promised a return to that. Many of us do not want that. Don't you get it, we cannot unite behind someone who is pro-war, anti-civil rights, pro-corporatism (in other words fascist), anti-poor, anti-working class, anti-peace, etc. You like Kerry so much, you vote for him but don't tell others how to vote. You can't have a democracy without people who believe in its principles.

does dennis even live in the US? 26.Mar.2004 13:58


Domain name: royaume.com

Fax: 1.14185450005
524 rue Albert
La Baie Quebec G7B 3L4

where I get my info 26.Mar.2004 14:03

kerry critic

"Interesting, I think, that some of the leftist critics of Kerry go to rightest web sites for their run-downs on Kerry."

I've gotten all my material straight from kerry's website and  http://thomas.loc.gov/. That's all I've needed to find ample criticism of Kerry, particularly in his supporting Bush's policies.

I guess I just don't understand: we need to unite to defeat Bush by voting for someone who has gone along with most of Bush's policies? I always used to think that democrats were rational but I guess that is no longer the case (if it ever was).

The Democratic Facade 26.Mar.2004 14:28

Voting as a Symbolic Act

excerpts from the book

The Democratic Facade

by Daniel Hellinger and Dennis R. Judd Brooks
Cole Publishing Company, 1991, paper

American Democracy as a Legitimating Device
American Schooling and the Cultural "Consensus"
Political Elites and the Media
Candidates, Elections, and the Propaganda Apparatus
Voting as a Symbolic Act
Political Discourse and the Electorate
The Best Elections Money Can Buy
The Decline of the Parties
The Hidden Governments
Democracy in the Garrison State
Exporting the Facade
Must Democracy in America Be a Facade?

Reign of the Mayberry Machiavellis 26.Mar.2004 14:59

Jim VandeHei

On Sunday, Hagel, a maverick Republican with a reputation similar to McCain's for speaking his mind, criticized the Bush campaign ad that called Kerry "weak on defense." Speaking on ABC's "This Week," Hagel said: "The facts just don't measure [up to] the rhetoric."

He said it is unfair to isolate one or two votes over a 19-year career to make such a sweeping assessment of Kerry. "You can . . . take any of us, and pick out the different votes, and then try to manufacture something around it," he said. ...

... While McCain and Hagel provided Kerry short-term cover, Clarke's comments could prove more damaging to Bush in the long run, Republican and Democratic strategists said. Clarke, who had a front-row seat to White House deliberations over al Qaeda and Iraq, is making the same case Kerry is -- that Bush could have done more to prevent the Sept. 11 attacks and should have done more to hunt down Osama bin Laden. A top GOP strategist, who insisted on anonymity because he represents clients with interests before the Bush administration, said Clarke's comment also built Kerry's case that Bush may have something to hide.

In a broader context, Clarke sounded concerns expressed by O'Neill and John J. DiIulio Jr., the former head of the White House Office of Faith-Based and Community Initiatives: that Bush is running an insulated White House driven by conservative ideology and politics. DiIulio, the first former Bush official to publicly criticize the president, said in a 2002 magazine interview that "it's the reign of the Mayberry Machiavellis."

to the author "you are not saying what people at portland.indy want to hear" 26.Mar.2004 16:10


To the author of the long response to my commentary... I could not have said it any better.
It appears you are gifted in the art of political verse, and the line of thinking that Kerry is a more "moderate" candidate than Bush is right on the money. It's frightening to see how much of an ogre he is being depicted as by many a writer contributing to this open forum. But, that's democracy. And it is necessary to reach certain truths. Also, you are also correct in stating that the majority of americans want the same things.....they are, in fact, "liberal" see Michale Moore's book "Dude, where's my country?". Poll after poll after poll shows that americans really don't mind civil union of gays, women's right to choose, environmental protection, curbing corporate corruption and the deception of workers, the quest for alternative energy sources, affordible health care, etc.
WE are all pretty normal. But, there is the fraction of the population (5%) who have most of the money in this country. And there are those who are loyal to those interests and will be regardless of what is "normal". Unfortunately, I know some young republicans who are deluded into thinking that because they make 100K$ a year, they are automatically part of the ruling elite...one was layed off, the other has no college education, etc.
They have been deluded by their party and truth is, hard core republicans (multi-millionare supporters of Bush) could not care less about young republicans or any other small fish. Again, my mantra, SOLIDARITY. Pick a realistic candidate who can get
us out of the hard right rule. Then, get more active. I support the ideas of the Green Party, and some still don't understand that. But....get a democrat in office, get him-reelected, and perchance a third party in america can exist. Look, Clinton tried for 8 years to get affordible health care. During a period when our country had the biggest surplus in history. Still, the stingy capitalists would hear nothing of it. Do you really think the stingy capitalists will roll over now and give you free health care and free education without years of a fight? The process must be more moderate than trying to cram a Nader down their throat. It didn't work last time.

To the author who decided to invade my privacy by tracking my host: what does that prove?
You missed the point. As a citizen of the US, yes, I live in Canada, so what? Would it matter if I lived in China? After having lost my job (layoffs in High Tech) and lost my live-in studio for artists. (after butting heads with landlords converting them into "luxury condos" in Boston)
That's right folks, one of those real statistics (3 million marginalized) after George Bush's economy caught up with them. I have lost more than most I know. It has not been easy. Living with the homeless veterans was very humbling. Now I live here. and I still care bout what happens in the US.

So you know what, keep your privacy invasion tactics to yourself... (do you work for Ashcroft, or what?) I post my full name and email, and am open for debate, which takes
a lot more courage than your anonymous little commentary. And imagine what a real politician must have to go thru. Maybe some of ya'll would be more understanding of Kerry.

Dennis in freakin Canada...
Who could actually just stay here with free health care
and a popular liberal government around the world. Why should I even care about politics in the US? Because I do. Kerry is multimillionare, why should he care about peoples' health care, education and corporate corruption? Because he does.

in other words 26.Mar.2004 16:27

ex-democrat voter

You don't live in the US but you want to tell people here how to vote. Why should we have any respect for that?

Why don't you do something productive like work toward solutions to the massive electoral fraud we are facing? Or is telling other people how to vote enough to make you feel like your are doing something worthwhile?

If you do not understand how the 2000 election was stolen and you are not working to keep that from happening again then you are working to keep Bush and his regime in power. You will spend the early days after the election blaming Nader instead of the republicans who orchastrated the coup in 2000 and in 2004 (including the Nader is a spoiler rhetoric). If you really like the last 4 years then by all means spend your time telling people to vote for Kerry. If you would rather see change then it's time to examine the roots of the problems that we have been facing and continue to face.

tried to post this earlier 26.Mar.2004 17:58


ex-democrat voter

You write,

"You don't live in the US but you want to tell people here how to vote. Why should we have any respect for that? "

What about the above post "Nader is Kicking Bu$h + Kerry's ASSES in US Election for the Rest of The World "?

the difference 26.Mar.2004 18:20

ex-democrat voter

The article you mention says, "Let's help the U.S. figure out who their president should be." Clearly the author has a bias but it is not saying you must vote this way or else.

In this article we here that same tired rhetoric a dozen times in just the article, not to mention the comments. The democrats have sold people out time and time again to manipulate people into voting for them and to benefit their own self-interest. And now is the same thing, vote for our guy or else. Well, I don't agree with Kerry, why should I vote for him, because I also don't agree with Bush? Two wrongs don't make a right as far as I'm concerned.

But really, it's hardly worth wasting time on such a poorly written article that contradicts itself repeatedly. I appreciate the author's passion, but he needs to get his facts straight and his arguments sound.

sorry Kuchinich supporters, he has excellent ideals but do you think the hard right will even let him on the white house lawn?
If it's the "hard right" that decides why would they treat Kerry any different then Kucinich?
Do you really think that those SOBs are gonna roll over and give up even if they are outvoted?
I certainly don't think this, but then why should I vote for Kerry, especially when his supporters have shown no interest in doing anything but roll over like the Gore supporters did in 2000.

4 more years of Nader blaiming and Karl Rove will laugh his ass off all the way to the bank. And he should, he's shown how absolutely gullible most democrats are, putting their energy, money, and time into all the wrong areas to accomplish what they say they want to accomplish. Will they learn in time? I'm not holding my breath.

ex-democrat voter 26.Mar.2004 18:43



"4 more years of Nader blaiming and Karl Rove will laugh his ass off all the way to the bank. And he should, he's shown how absolutely gullible most democrats are, putting their energy, money, and time into all the wrong areas to accomplish what they say they want to accomplish. Will they learn in time? I'm not holding my breath."

In 2008 Nader, who? Are you going to try to defeat Bush by calling the Democrats gullible for eight more months?

Finally I'm glad you understand breathing. Now what I asked you was why Dennis in Canada can't have a say and who the fuck lead you to think you can say it. Mr Republican friend.

answers 26.Mar.2004 19:06

ex-democrat voter

"Are you going to try to defeat Bush by calling the Democrats gullible for eight more months?"

Among other things, yes, I'm going to keep pointing out that the 2000 election was stolen and that the 2004 election will be stolen as well and people should learn about the HAVA, Diebold, ESS, Sequoia, voting "peculiarities" in Nebraska, Georgia, California, Florida, and many other states. At least by educating people ahead of time what they're up against maybe something can be done when the vote "counts" all declare Bush to be the victor. And if they insist that Nader cost Bush the election in 2000 I'm going to call them gullible, and I thought you'd agree since you're aware of at least the voter purges and I would hope the rigging of the voting machines in predominantly minority counties in Florida.

"Now what I asked you was why Dennis in Canada can't have a say"

Nice straw-man. I never said he couldn't have a say, just that I wouldn't respect him for telling other people how to vote. If someone said vote for Nader or else the world is going to end YOU WILL BE TO BLAME I wouldn't respect that either (but I haven't heard that yet, have you?). Telling another person how they should vote is undemocratic, to say the least. And it's frequent use by democrats (particularly the Kerry-supporters) leads me to believe that they care more about having "their" candidate leading the US empire rather than actually caring about the wars being waged in our name and the state of our so-called democracy.

ex-democrat voter 26.Mar.2004 19:38


A couple of points in your last post we agree completely in what you say in your first paragraph. In fact I an working with some well placed engineers to come up with an Electronic Election Fraud for Dummies post. You are right NO ONE IN THE INDUSTRY beleives the machines can work.

However you did seem to question Dennis when you said, "You don't live in the US but you want to tell people here how to vote. Why should we have any respect for that? " So you saying he can have a say, big of you, but you want respect it?

Here you go again.

"....(particularly the Kerry-supporters) leads me to believe that they care more about having "their" candidate leading the US empire rather than actually caring about the wars being waged in our name and the state of our so-called democracy. "

Shame on you, grow the fuck up. When you write your name as 'ex-democrat' the party IQ goes up.

questions for jlii 26.Mar.2004 20:07

ex-democrat voter

Can you really not tell the difference between a person expressing their opinion and someone telling others what to think?

Why do you care that I don't respect those that tell other people who to vote for or what to thing?

Do you ever post without resorting to ad-hominem attacks?

ex-democrat voter 26.Mar.2004 20:28


"Do you ever post without resorting to ad-hominem attacks?"


Geez ex-dem 26.Mar.2004 22:43

What are you, a Republican?

Dennis said "vote for our guy or else?" Where? Or else what? Did he threaten you? NO. He just gave his opinion and tried to use persuasion. That's what most people do here.

What are you afraid of? And for the others who want Dennis' posts composted... SHAME ON YOU! An open forum is open only to people you agree with? You sound like Bush. Frankly you could be on his side. It's so hard to tell these days who is stupid enough to be manipulated by them, and who is legitimately playing for their side.

Vote for whoever the hell you want. Nobody here is stopping you. You show your true colors when you try to stop others from expressing their views.

I've been called worse 27.Mar.2004 02:36

ex-democrat voter

"Dennis said "vote for our guy or else?" Where? Or else what?"

Not that I should waste time posting quotes from an article that sits at the top of this page but:
"we need to stick together to get rid of Bush, at all cost"
"if you don't vote for the Democratic nominee , you are going to learn a hard lesson all over again"
"But if we don't stand united, against the Bush machine, WE ARE TO BLAME FOR ALL WE GET! PERIOD!"

"What are you afraid of?"

I don't know, nothing I can think of. I'm not afraid of 4 more years of Bush unlike most people here. I'm not afraid of 4 years of Kerry.

"You show your true colors when you try to stop others from expressing their views."

Again with that straw-man. If you can't accept my opinion that's fine, but I'm not going to be silenced by your false accusations that I'm trying to "stop others from expressing their views". I don't respect people telling people who to vote for, something I have never done, and I don't respect people trying to scare people to manipulate them into voting for their chosen candidate. I don't like it when the republicans do it and I don't like it when the democrats do it. The democrats should have learned form the primaries that people want to hear something positive, despite their continued voting out of fear. Voting out of fear is not democracy; if you do not have the freedom to vote for who you want, how can you be said to have democracy at all? I want democracy and I'm willing to fight for it. That means fighting for anyone who wants to be on the ballot to be on it, for as many parties as want to run to be able to, and for people to decide for themselves who they want to vote for. Anyone that disagrees with this is free to do so, but in my opinion they are working against the principles of democracy and if democracy is what we seek, we cannot abandon its principles.

Dennis from Canada 27.Mar.2004 09:42

Dennis from Canada

well well, I apologize if I have used something that can be construed as an ad hominem attack. Frankly, it must be my military roots-which I completely rejected.
But, I am a liberal, and have taken the political compass test. (Just so readers of this page can get a sense that I am not a Republican plant) The political compass (a pretty good, objective test by an organization in the UK, politicalcompass.org) measures Bush as somewhat near Maragaret Thatcher and Adolf Hitler. (upper right quadrant) It measures Kerry as somewhat slight right, near the in the center, close to Prime Minister Martin (Canada) and Minister Schroeder (Germany). (Personally, I measure next to Ghandi and the Dalai Lama. Surprising) So, thinking I am some kind of neo whatever is wrong. I am trying to urge Solidarity against the far right wingers. The Green Party voted in at a 4% margin in Oregon in 2000. Quite a monority. In order for a third party to exist in the US,
it makes sense to first to vote a more moderate candidate in. See what I'm getting at? Canada and Germany are all composed of multiple partied governments. ( the number of parties in Germany, for example, has been up to 5 at one time) Those leaders are more tolerant of new parties. You will find no such tolerance in the current admin. It could take two terms of a moderate democart to get your party recognized. But it is possible under those conditions only. (again, if a man like Clinton couldn't get cheaper health care in a democratic congress during on of the wealthiest eras americans have ever seen,
how would it be possible for a far left party to be recognized in this current climate?)

And yes, there is much to fear if Bush is re-elected. Another 9/11, for example.
More corporate corruption, environment pollution, continued expenditure of our tax dollars for military expeditions, costing american lives, maybe a draft...and you have nothing to say about it...matter of fact you would be branded anarchists and dissidents if you continued...and your authorities (bush, cheney, rice) go behind closed panel meetings, or refuse to testify in public for accountability....AND SOME READERS CONJECTURE THAT I MUST BE AFRIAD OF SOMETHING? you should be afraid, if you already aren't. What is it going to take to push the far right out of power? Those of us opposed to it, as we argue amongst ourselves, weaken the front. That is all I'm saying.
And attacking me for living in Canada, for 4 months now, is irrevelant an just demonstrates a lack of focusing on discussion! An open forum, so be careful not be hypocritical, in dismissing the somewhat awkward logic I am employing: solidarity.
2500 dead on 9/11, 500+ dead in Iraq, how many dead in Afhganistan, about 200 dead in Spain...not counting the civilians dead in the countries we are at war with. We have much to fear...

dennis from freakin' canada 27.Mar.2004 12:19

mary from freakin cambridge uscitizen5@aol.com


you seem like a good egg, and i am happy we still have friends in canada who care for our health, wealth and over all well being. cheers, smoke a dubie for me.

for the Nader folks. he's a great guy, wonderful voice of reason. and i hope -- pray, that one day he takes his role in washington. now is not the time.

and when The Nation, the publication that gave Ralph Nader his voice, pleads with him not to run, not now, one really has to step back... consider the importance of timing.... and be real.

[see "Ralph Don't Run"  http://www.thenation.com/doc.mhtml?i=20021202&s=dugger]


I refuse to live in fear 27.Mar.2004 13:12

ex-democrat voter

Dennis, at least you can admit that you are voting out of fear. I wish all Kerry supporters were as honest. I am not afraid of Bush or Kerry I will not allow the democrats or republicans to use fear to control me. The democrats are deliberately allowing Bush's legislation to pass to make people afraid. It's political posturing that is hurting everyday people and I will not reward them for that.

Also, I was not talking about an ad-hominem attack. You didn't resort to that so far as I can tell. You're merely trying to make other people feel your fear and tell them what to do about it. This I cannot respect. You should state, as you just did that you are afraid of Bush, your reasons, and why you think that for you, that justifies voting for Kerry. I suspect you will find that approach much more effective; that is, rather than telling people what they should do and why they should do it, just share your experience and see if people can relate to that. And if not, wish them the best in practicing what's left of our democracy.

Hey D. why don't you tell them why you're really in Canada? 20.Jul.2004 16:36

Lt. Col Lingenfelter USMC Ret.

"Dennis from Canada" was once one of the most highly trained and experienced covert military operatives in the world. After decades of services in the most despicable theaters of U.S. involvement "Dennis" was abandoned by our government and left to die... His family, murdered and his one true love sent to a frozen wasteland to await death.

"Dennis" knows more about the savage nature of our political reality than any of us can imagine but his training has taught him to ignore pain and disappear into his surroundings. Very much like the ghost that he has become for our own president's father. Do you think he still sees you standing there "Dennis?" As I do? As They all do?

Keep searching for her "Dennis," she is there somewhere. Novokutznetsk has finished his mission but she is not there. If it were not for you that day in Grenada my friend none of us would be home now.

As for the rest of you! Do as he asks! Listen to him. You owe him that much. We all do.