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The Scariest Part

The scaeiest part of all this is that one has to ask the question: is this really what so much of the population thinks, despite the stress of the times? 'Capitans of Indusry' running government? Wasn't it bad enough with simple thieves? It's no wonder thinkers are drawing parallels to Fascism.
Despite any excuses or reasoning one can use, the bigotry is disgustingly ugly on both sides, particulaely when one has the models of the 20s abd 30s before them.
Mirror, mirror, on the wall...It ain't no fairy tale, and like fairy tales and other fables where one can draw parallels to real iife, let's hope we learn the moral from it.
It has one (a moral), you know, all the way back to the Magna Carta...
Winston Churchill said that, "The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter."
Be scared that, in his cynicism, Winston may have been correct.

'Capitans of Indusry' [sic] ? 01.Feb.2017 11:10

_

This is 'new', to you?

remember Bushes? Zapata Petroleum. Rumsfeld = nuclear, and pharmaceutical executive.

there is absolutely nothing new under the sun.

some people's kids 01.Feb.2017 16:20

correcting the rude comment

The original post says nothing about "all this" as being "new" to them.(?!) And you derogatory comment doesn't help with disseminating helpful information, even if there is absolutely nothing new under the sun with the info. The fact your comment did not help in this forum any way, is obvious to any reader, although it did served your own ego well (I presume)?

"correcting" 01.Feb.2017 17:15

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QUOTE:
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"some people's kids" 01.Feb.2017 16:20
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Who let you out of the playpen?



QUOTE:
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" the rude comment "
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What was "rude"?



QUOTE:
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"The original post says nothing about "all this" as being "new" to them.(?!)"
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Oh yes: (Quoted from the original post)
"It's no wonder thinkers are drawing parallels to Fascism." ' " models of the 20s abd[sic] 30s before them "
AS THOUGH IT WAS SOMETHING 'new'.

Hence the reminder about Bush, Rumsfeld, Cheney, Obama (big banks-multinational insurance) etc.

The 1980s and 1990s (not just "20s 30s"), and 2000s. Right up until today.

if we're ? going to bring up fascism:
let's por favor have a reasoned, factual, historically accurate and clear discussion about that topic.
Not hysterics, obfuscation and emotion.



QUOTE:
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"And you[sic] derogatory comment doesn't help with disseminating helpful information"
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It does - see explanation/example ^above.
We live in a 21st century corporate capitalist plutocracy ('fascism' by any other name). The progression to this state of American corporate governance, began in November 1980 with the election of Reagan and has continued apace with each new presidential administration that has followed.

Ought be viewed and discussed in that context (not in bizarre historical sleight of hand references to 1930s Europe, there's no comparison here/now-to-there/then).

Additionally, Obama will prove to be not much different from Trump, just as Obama's record in 8 years office is not substantially different from predecessor Bush (in fact Obama prosecuted more aerial bombardment of third world nations/peoples, than did Bush)



QUOTE:
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" The fact your comment "
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Yes, my comment is fact.



QUOTE:
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"did not help in this forum any way"
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Indymedia is not a 'forum'.

Yes (you're wrong) my comment added fact and clarity into the topic, i.e. my comment helped.



QUOTE:
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"is obvious to any reader, although it did served your own ego well (I presume)?"
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Yeah let's just stick to the facts (which you presumably have a difficult time with).



QUOTE:
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"even if there is absolutely nothing new under the sun with the info "
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Agreed (by your own admission) you lose.

Really bad to quote selectively 02.Feb.2017 10:25

Mike Novack

Two things wrong with this:

"Winston Churchill said that, "The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter."
Be scared that, in his cynicism, Winston may have been correct."

The first is that one needs to take this one in the context of his very famous quote about how bad democracy was EXCEPT in comparison to all the alternative. Churchill argued that democracy had lots of "warts" but the alternatives had running sores. Churchill is a poor choice for a spokesperson taking the anti-democracy side.

The second is perhaps more interesting. Because it DOESN'T follow that even if true that each voter individually has serious defects the result of polling them would give a bad result. Perhaps most of the time the defects of all the individual voters cancel out.

Mind, democracy is NOT designed to produce good, just, fair, wise, etc. decisions. When working properly, ALL that we can expect is that the decisions made will be the ones that the people want, for good or for ill. It is precisely when those defects do not cancel out, democracy can give us terrible decisions. When the majority of voters are prejudiced in the same way, for example.

It is for this reason that it might be good to have only limited democracy, to spell out matters that will NOT be decided by majority rule. Usually matters where we expect the majority likely to be prejudiced in the same way. That is what a "Bill of Rights" is for.

With an Infiltrated and Controlled Media ... 02.Feb.2017 14:04

Tracy Mapes

...There is no "What People Think" included in the equation.

To those who think they are involved in a democracy? ...are only fooling themselves.

There is no democracy, there is no Bill of Rights, there is no Constitution, only the facade of a dream sold to the masses to keep them from abandoning the false hopes planted in their tiny brains by the Robber Barons.

And as long as Law-Enforcement and the Corrupt Justice System defend them, they will have lost their prerogative of taxation and representation of the People of the United States.

With a 240 Year History, and incomplete history as a Union, 10 Trillion Dollars was spent in the first 230 Years, and approximately 10 more Trillion Dollars will be spent in this decade of madness by the Year 2020.

This is not sustainable. This not something Americans voted for. This is no longer the People's Country.

If you cannot comprehend what those numbers mean for your future? Keep on defending the system, and you will be handed your own Asses.

The Red 'X' Society recommends defunding the All U.S. and Local Government until The People and the Government can achieve a "New Deal."

At the Current level of the Public's willingness to accept the Criminal Enterprise that Mis-Manages this Country's Affairs may preclude any individual hope of resurrecting the professed 'Ideals of America without Extreme violent Civil Conflict.

The Red 'X' Society