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Do liberals support package theft from porch’s?

Is package theft a crime or just re-distribution of wealth?
Since many liberals already support property theft in various forms, it begs the question, "Is it wrong to steal packages, or is the theft justified? Obviously, conservatives are against the practice but I'm curious about what the left wing thinks. Someone receiving a package is probably a capitalist? What does the ACLU think?

Merry Christmas 25.Dec.2018 13:08

blues

Take all your precious private property and shove it where the sun don't shine.

And find something solvable to worry about, idiot.

Porch pirates stole old (not new) used books from my doorstep 25.Dec.2018 15:16

_

probably just threw them in the dumpster after stealing,

when they figured out that the Pawn Shop wouldn't give them cash for the items, so that they could buy-deal more methamphetamine / other pharmaceuticals to support their JunkieMonkey.


( packages on my porch are now booby-trapped. Porch pirates should be killed / permanently maimed on sight. )

glitter bomb package theft set up 25.Dec.2018 22:01

oh

 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xoxhDk-hwuo

==

This might be my Magnum Opus. Please see my comments below with regards to reports the video was partially faked. Go to  https://NordVPN.com/MarkRober and use code MARKROBER to get 75% off a 3 year plan and an extra month for free.

My buddy Sean posted a video with more details of the build:  https://youtu.be/IpMxOmUcfOI

Note about 2 missing the reactions in the video- I was presented with information that caused me to doubt the veracity of 2 of the 5 reactions in the video. These were reactions that were captured during a two week period while the device was at house 2 hours away from where I live. I put a feeler out for people willing to put a package on their porch and this person (who is a friend of a friend) volunteered to help. To compensate them for their time and willingness to risk putting a package on their porch I offered financial compensation for any successful recoveries of the package. It appears (and I've since confirmed) in these two cases, the "thieves" were actually acquaintances of the person helping me. From the footage I received from the phones which intentionally only record at specific times, this wasn't clear to me. I have since removed those reactions from the original video (originally 6:26-7:59). I'm really sorry about this. Ultimately, I am responsible for the content that goes on my channel and I should have done more here. I can vouch for that the reactions were genuine when the package was taken from my house. Having said that, I know my credibly is sort of shot but I encourage you to look at the types of videos I've been making for the past 7 years. This is my first ever video with some kind of "prank" and like I mentioned in the video it's pretty removed from my comfort zone and I should have done more. I'm especially gutted because so much thought, time, money and effort went into building the device and I hope this doesn't just taint the entire effort as "fake". It genuinely works (like all the other things I've built on my channel) and we've made all the code and build info public. Again, I'm sorry for putting something up on my channel that was misleading. That is totally on me and I will take all necessary steps to make sure it won't happen again.

p.s. RE: the stolen used books 25.Dec.2018 22:28

_

when I reported this theft to Portland Police Bureau,

absolutely nothing was done. Responding officer acted like I was disrupting his evening to have officially reported this (so I apologized for having Harshed His Mellow and told him to go back to having a Fun Night like he supposedly was before he showed up to the crime scene at my residence).


**** the (useless/purposeless) police.

Depends 27.Dec.2018 18:06

Malloy

I was raised a Christian in the true sense of following the gospels, that is, what Jesus preached and did. If a person is hungry and there is food being delivered to the porch, there is nothing wrong with taking that food. And the person who owns the house, if he is a Christian, should rejoice knowing that in feeding the hungry, he fed Jesus, as He states in the gospels.

I am always dismayed by how often those Christians who identify as conservatives do everything they can to avoid acting as Jesus said they should. At least non-Christian conservatives don't lay claim to having the mantel of Jesus when they treat others exactly as they would never wish to be treated.

RE: ^ " If a person is hungry and there is food being delivered " <— Neither. 29.Dec.2018 00:06

_

yeah (Not speaking here on behalf of either your purported "conservatives" or Christians),

"Malloy" your metaphor is inappropriate, inapplicable here and you should Feel Bad.


problem is that most of the Porch Pirates are not "hungry" and "food" is not "being delivered".

Matter of fact, most Porch Pirates are either 1) tweakers / on drugs [because For Example pharmaceuticals/vitamins are commonly shipped by mail-package delivery and the tweakers seek their next quick fix and-or recipe ingredients for future product or re-sale], or simply 2) bad-Dumb criminals.


i.e. 'smart' criminals (or even let's say Expropriating Re-Distrubution specialist "real Christ-followers" or what ever it is you had-in-metaphorical-mind ^, "Malloy") would not knowingly get into or stick with Porch Pirating as a methodology of "striking it rich".

Anyway if you really want to do Christ's bidding and Re-Distribute wealth / resources (/ 'food'... for the 'hungry') go ahead and have the Guts, wherewithal to be an actual Burglar, or car thief. That'll show 'em.

rather than purloining random items off peoples' porches. ( Pirates could be stealing a person's much needed alternative cancer herbals treatement package. What comes around goes around. )

Not a metaphor 29.Dec.2018 16:07

Malloy

I am not sure where I stated what I wrote was a metaphor. I was referring to real hungry people and real food. I gave a precise example. Not a metaphor. And not full of any of the extraneous items you have added to what I wrote to fit your point.

It's a pretty simple statement: if a person is hungry and the item on the porch is food, I see nothing wrong with that person taking that food, and there is nothing I can find in doing that which is inconsistent with what Jesus spoke and did in the gospels.

RE: "I gave a precise example." NO, you Absolutely Did NOT. 30.Dec.2018 22:11

>

Documentation please, immediately,
of the specific "example" incidents where FOOD had been taken from someone's porch?
[ QUOTE from 'Malloy': "if the item on the porch is food" / "taking that food" / "person is hungry" ]


NO "food" (i.e. consumable-by-human-mouth organic animal meat or vegetable produce / nourishment) has been taken from a porch and neither do you, 'Malloy', have specific documentation of <— that.

"Hunger" or "Food" taken from porches are **NOT** the topic here.




Sturmgewehr Evolution of the Sturmgewehr: MP43/1, MP43, MP44, and StG44




( p.s. why are you "not sure I stated what I wrote was a metaphor" ? Of course *you* did not "state" the word 'metaphor' itself.
YOU WROTE A METAPHORICAL FIGURE OF SPEECH MADE UP FICTITIOUSLY IN YOUR OWN MIND, WITH ZERO EVIDENCE OF AN ACTUAL, REAL WORLD EVENT.
You are deficient in English grammar. A metaphor is a figure of speech in which a word or phrase denoting one kind of object or action [ "FOOD" taken from porch" / "hungry person" ] is used in place of another to suggest a likeness or analogy between [PRIVATE PROPERTY/Material Object taken from porch] them. )

Nope, and I am sorry that you have not yet learned to read 31.Dec.2018 07:23

Malloy

Nope, but you are more than welcome to jump to conclusions. It's a free country, to some degree.

You are correct in writing that hunger or food taken from porches is not the issue. And I never stated anywhere that it was.

The issue was whether package theft is a crime or a matter of wealth distribution. I gave a specific example where it would arguably not be a crime. To me it would not be one. You might disagree, which is fine. For the record, I have had a food package (literal, not metaphorical) stolen from my porch, and I watched the person (literal, not metaphorical) eat (literally, not metaphorically) that food (etc.) my mother (again) had sent (same), so if you want that documentation there it is. But I would think for any person that learned how to read, it was obvious that I was providing a hypothetical. Maybe that should for any person who learned to read well.

But speaking of documentation, please provide your proof of this statement your wrote: "...most of the Porch Pirates are not "hungry" and "food" is not "being delivered"." I've scoured the internet, and I have not found any proof at all beyond anecdotal. So please, do show me your data. Ditto that most of them are "tweakers" or "bad/Dumb criminals." For the record I am not asking for metaphorical hunger, food, tweakers, or criminals: just data please, preferably of a reasonably sized sample.

Also, I am touched that you understand what a metaphor is. Now you should work on applying the term to actual metaphors instead of hypotheticals.

Sorry that you, "Malloy" are illiterate : 31.Dec.2018 17:55

_

Malloy wrote [QUOTE]:
----
"You are correct in writing that hunger or food taken from porches is not the issue. And I never stated anywhere that it was."
----

YES YOU DID. You made a *metaphorical* and hypothetical ( "if" a person, "if" there is ) stated assertion in your initial posting here, that [QUOTE]:
"I was raised a Christian in the true sense of following the gospels, that is, what Jesus preached and did. If a person is hungry and there is food being delivered to the porch"

^^
1) METAPHORICAL about food being delivered ( *no* "food" involved, whatsoever )
2) Hypothetical "if" situation ( *no* "food" delivered, anywhere )



Malloy wrote [QUOTE]:
----
"Now you should work on applying the term to actual metaphors instead of hypotheticals."
----

Now you should work on providing real world evidence for your assertions,
instead of being a Liar and claiming that you in fact provided a "specific example" when you did nothing of the sort.



Malloy wrote [QUOTE]:
----
"The issue was whether package theft is a crime or a matter of wealth distribution."
----

The original posting here on Portland Indymedia is titled : Do liberals support package theft from [sic] porch's?

and yes, does ask the hypothetical question about package theft being a "crime or just re-distribution of wealth"



Malloy wrote [QUOTE]:
----
"I gave a specific example where it would arguably not be a crime."
----

You, "Malloy" are a LIAR. You **DID NOT** provide any sort of "specific" example, and theft of private property from one's residence is *always* a crime (it just perhaps? might not be prosecuted and/or adjudicated as such if, e.g. the victim chose not to bother to report it to law enforcement or otherwise "didn't care" or 'actually wanted' the theft itself to occur...)




Malloy wrote [QUOTE]:
----
"For the record, I have had a food package (literal, not metaphorical) stolen from my porch, and I watched the person (literal, not metaphorical) eat (literally, not metaphorically) that food (etc.) my mother (again) had sent (same), so if you want that documentation there it is."
----

Please explain/clarify ^ **THIS** SPECIFIC (purported) INCIDENT.

MORE DOCUMENTATION required, here.

1) You're asserting that a family member sent you a package of food (product/items/fresh produce)?
Describe the item / package / "food" 'stuff'.

2)What method, specifically was that delivered (By your mother, personally?? United States Postal Service?? Courier service?? <--THIS IS IMPORTANT ACCORDING TO HOW THE PACKAGING WAS MARKED AND THUS APPEARED TO A POTENTIAL THIEF.)



Malloy wrote [QUOTE]:
----
"But speaking of documentation, please provide your proof of this statement your wrote: "...most of the Porch Pirates are not "hungry" and "food" is not "being delivered"." I've scoured the internet, and I have not found any proof at all beyond anecdotal. So please, do show me your data. Ditto that most of them are "tweakers" or "bad/Dumb criminals." For the record I am not asking for metaphorical hunger, food, tweakers, or criminals: just data please, preferably of a reasonably sized sample."
----

Federal law provides that "Theft or Receipt of Stolen Mail Matter" is a felony punishable by up to five years in prison, along with a fine. Additional larceny charges based on the value of stole goods are also possible.

The FBI keeps no nationwide statistics on package theft (presumably due to low reporting and resolution/prosecution rates - see below), but polls show that one third of Americans have personally experienced it.
It is also well documented for the past few decades that package theft incidence incurs a spike during the Christmas season (perhaps also the timely impetus for "Anon"'s posting here on Portland Indymedia).

Concerning *specifically* the 'holiday season' and incidence of package theft therein,
Over 25 million Americans have been the victims of a holiday package robbery, an increase from 23.5 million porch thefts reported in 2015, according to a new report from Insurance Quotes  link to www.insurancequotes.com

One problem in the crime statistics on package and mail theft overall, is that — unlike other burglary and theft-related crime — package theft itself is under-reported to police by victims because of the low probability of it being resolved or successfully prosecuted (without the victim having some sort of video-material documentation of the actual incident while it occurred) to law enforcement. Hence, the lack of FBI statistical data on 'porch package theft' as a specific crime.

Victims mostly don't bother even reporting it as a police/theft incident because of the extremely low likelihood of resolution, and also that delivery insurance — if had been obtained in advance — on certain items may cover the value for the victim (whether the criminal would be 'caught', in that case, doesn't matter so much as the value of the item being taken care of).
See ^^ my story of the stolen used books from my front porch (which has increased my own personal desire to obtain a camera security surveillance system at my residence).

Some thieves (the 'smarter' ones that is...) are so cunning, they can make it hard to tell at first that you've been robbed. In the Malverne area of Long Island, New York, one notorious robber that police are pursuing steals packages and *replaces them* with boxes that look like delivered goods, but are in fact filled with trash and garbage, according to Newsday  http://www.newsday.com/long-island/crime/malverne-holiday-package-thief-1.15323527

By-mail retailers such as Amazon dawt com, in addition to local law enforcement organizations across the country, have recently taken measures to apprehend and track package theft from neighborhood porches.

Here is a local news story about the Washington County Sheriff's Department using "bait" packages to catch package thieves.
If the Sheriff's Dept. / law enforcement officials thought that, somehow, there was a greater probability of them being sued or otherwise taken-to-legal-task by "mis-apprehending" a "hungry person" who "just wanted food" from a person's porch I'm reasonably certain they would not pursue such a policy.

_________

 link to katu.com

Thieves taking the 'bait,' deputies plant GPS packages across Washington Co.

HILLSBORO, Ore. — Washington County Sheriff's Deputies are using more "bait packages" this holiday season to catch package thieves.

Deputies put sensors inside of shipping boxes and leave them on local porches. If the packages are picked up, they use GPS, cell phone signal and a radio frequency transmitter to track them down.

The Sheriff's Office would not tell KATU News how many bait packages they are using, but said it is double the amount used in previous years.

"Package thefts rise this time of year due to people Christmas shopping. A lot of purchasing online and having things delivered to their homes. It's a great opportunity (for thieves) to take what (they) want," said Detective Patrick Altiere.

If the package is in a car, deputies are able to track the driver's every turn.

In 2017, deputies arrested three people who stole bait packages. Each one was charged with mail theft, among other charges.

The sheriff's office is able to place twice the amount of bait packages due to a donation from the Sheriff's Office Foundation of Washington County.

Detective Altiere hopes to see a decrease in package thefts as a result.

"We want to deter people from trying to ruin peoples holidays and we want to keep the things they purchased safe," Altiere said.

The sheriff's office recommends customers use a services such as Amazon lockers or a neighbor that is home. They encourage people to use home video surveillance devices.

_________



Not just locally, also in New Jersey (local police department) :


 link to www.nbcphiladelphia.com

Police Use Fake Amazon Boxes, GPS to Catch 'Porch Pirates'

Police in Jersey City have partnered with Amazon to catch thieves in the act or as they make their getaway

Published Dec 12, 2018 at 7:29 AM | Updated at 11:00 AM EST on Dec 12, 2018

derp 01.Jan.2019 15:43

leafhall

obvious this was started by a right winger

" derp leafhall obvious this was started by a right winger "— No Shit. 01.Jan.2019 16:23

01.Jan.2019 15:43

Here Are The Clues —

1) author: Anon ("Anon" being the usage/vernacular of 4chan, well known haven for depraved child abusing right wingers)

2) Title of article: "Do liberals support package theft from [sic]porch's?"

Note use of "liberals" (<— as though anyone on Indymedia cares about "liberal" as a philosophy, political orientation/ideology, or demographic)
and the deliberately mis-spelled/typo "porch's"


Trollin', trollin', trollin'.

( but FWIW it got the 'Christian' advocate "Malloy" to bring out the "food" / "hunger" paradigm anyhoo ... )

Addendum — 01.Jan.2019 16:30

>

in theory this topic which this Fascist Troll posted here to the Portland Indymedia newswire, could have or was-intended[?]-to-be been about


Expropriation.
( which was briefly alluded to / discussed by at least 1 comment thus far... )


i.e. the clumsily self-betraying use of "liberal" (as an Ideology-moniker, for users of Indy?!) in the title, was deployed to deliberately "rile" (which it far from did, for this reader) persons here


Could have just as easily used, instead of word "liberal",

"Anyone here"

or

"Do you"

as substitute phrases.

But then, there's the subsequent [QUOTE]: "many liberals already support property theft in various forms"
which is par-for-course, 14-year-old white cis-boy 4chan-fan lingo.